Guest Anonymous Posted February 17, 2003 Report Share Posted February 17, 2003 i'm considering to buy Sony N10 NETMD but i have a number of questions wanted to be solved. :? First,Why do NetMD cannot achieve a true SP sound quality(292kbps)? Because of the restriction of the software(OpenMG or Sonic Stage), or the hardware itself is not designed to record in high quality? Second, can a non-NetMD MD recorder achieve the true SP sound quality when recording music from CD using the optical input? If so, can NetMD achieve true SP quality recording from optical input? Really appreciated if answered, Thanks in advance. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sugo Posted February 18, 2003 Report Share Posted February 18, 2003 Audio files cannot be uploaded to a NetMD recorder in real SP partly because the NetMD protocol doesn't support it. The software provided by sony only lets you encode in ATRAC3 instead of ATRAC. It is not obvious if the hardware can support it. In short, it just cannot be done for now. Any MD recorder (whether NetMD capable or not) can do real SP recording via optical as long as it has an optical input. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Anonymous Posted February 18, 2003 Report Share Posted February 18, 2003 thx a lot Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Polo Posted February 25, 2003 Report Share Posted February 25, 2003 to Sugo. Iam afraid that you're wrong. NetMD is able to record SP via USB but the stupid software won't let you. The only way is to grab your audio cd to harddrive and then send it using import and check in/out, in this case the software will ask you in which format you want store the track. btw:SP transfer takes much more time... Good Luck! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sugo Posted February 25, 2003 Report Share Posted February 25, 2003 When recording in SP mode through netmd, the software enocdes the audio file into LP2 ATRAC3 format, decodes the LP2 and sends encrypted PCM raw data to the MD recorder. The recorded track is in SP format, but quality wise it's only LP2. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Anonymous Posted February 25, 2003 Report Share Posted February 25, 2003 Are there any articles about it? Or how do you know?? If is that true, then i must say that the more iam getting in deep with NetMD the more iam confused :-( btw: SonicStage allow you to transfer music directly from cd -> md in Sp mode. p.s. are you talking about wave files(16bit/44.1Khz) stored on harddrive? I do. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Polo Posted February 25, 2003 Report Share Posted February 25, 2003 guest(last one) == Polo :-) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sugo Posted February 25, 2003 Report Share Posted February 25, 2003 It's mentioned on the sony manuals. You can also search on this forum or T-Board for more information. I wished what you said is true, then we all don't have to mess with real time Toslink recording anymore ... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Polo Posted February 26, 2003 Report Share Posted February 26, 2003 Hi... Bad news for me is that youre right :-) I'll do some sound tests at weekend, then it will be clear. Honesly, i dont get why sony wount let upload real SP data in to MD .. Its GREAT disapointment.. I wish to all people, who have time and motivation to break that "code", LOT LOT LOT of LUCK and enegi. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MDX-400 Posted February 26, 2003 Report Share Posted February 26, 2003 Honesly, i dont get why sony wount let upload real SP data in to MD .. Its GREAT disapointment.. I wish to all people, who have time and motivation to break that "code", LOT LOT LOT of LUCK and enegi.The answer to this is simple. Sony keeps ATRAC under "lock and key" relative to their treatment of the ATRAC3 codec. ATRAC3 and ATRAC are pretty much all together different formats entirely. The confusion comes when they decided to start allowing MD recorders to use ATRAC3 in the form of MDLP. ATRAC3 codec is all over the place, relative to ATRAC... You see it on Memory Sticks, portable CD players (now), and other Sony devices. Additionally ATRAC3 is for open computer use via Real Player... ATRAC on the other hand is much more tightly guarded. The licensing fees for its use are likely larger than ATRAC3 and also they don't just license it out for free use on PCs... Given, ATRAC3 via NetMD does have to follow all the rules of check-in/out and that business it is still insecure relative to ATRAC. Sony knows that once something is let out like ATRAC3 on the PC, it won't be that long until someone hacks it and circumvents the restrictions (I'm not referring to the no upload restriction as that it prevented by hardware, however). It may have something to do with the fact that the use of ATRAC still requires some sort of royalty to be paid to Dolby Labs because of the (inadvertent but court decided) incorporation of Dolby technology into it. Also ATRAC was designed under strict copyright intentions and in the "spirit" of SCMS. Letting it out for any Tom, Dick and whomever to use on a computer would be letting ATRAC become much less regulated and Sony won't let that happen. So for perhaps historical, perhaps the Dolby reasons (or maybe a bit of both), and for the reason of Sony's intention to keep ATRAC a tightly regulated codec, I doubt we will ever see Sony allow the ATRAC stream to be "willy nilly" thrown across PCs via USB or anything else. Roland M. PS: There is no "code" to break. There is no way to use ATRAC on the PC and this is a hardware thing, not software. NetMD ONLY allows ATRAC3 data to be transmitted, I'm pretty sure. When you record an "SP" track via NetMD the computer does the ATRAC3 business and still ONLY ATRAC3 is transmitted across the USB. The MD recorder itself encodes the ATRAC data. It is either like that or the PC transmits decoded ATRAC3 in the form of PCM over USB and then the recorder encodes it to ATRAC. I could be wrong on that but I HIGHLY doubt that ATRAC is ever moved over USB either to or from the MD recorder to the PC. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bazirker Posted February 27, 2003 Report Share Posted February 27, 2003 MDX400...awwww man, you beat me to it! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MDX-400 Posted February 27, 2003 Report Share Posted February 27, 2003 MDX400...awwww man, you beat me to it!Hee Hee Well apparently, though, from what I am reading on the T-forum, Zyan seems to have it narrowed down... He says that the transfer to SP is (like my second assumption) actually done over USB not in ATRAC3 format but in some linear form of digital audio already decoded from ATRAC3, similar to PCM. The MD recorder then encodes that linear (decoded) digital information to ATRAC (MDSP). If this is the case, which it very well may be, then there IS a possibility of transferring TO SP over NetMD in full quality. The only thing would be to get the software (via hacking it or writing new software) in order for it to send that same data, but instead of from a decoded ATRAC3 file, directly from a superior format (such as full quality .wav or even a high bit-rate (decoded) MP3 file). If this were possible then you make SP tracks with SP quality all while the recorder thinks it is getting decoded ATRAC3 over USB as in the standard "transfer" of "SP" via NetMD. Still no ATRAC is going over USB, but a full quality, faster than real-time recording MIGHT be possible. For more on this I should direct you to Zyan's thread (sorry about linking off this forum but the thread is quite informative) on the T-Station: http://www.minidisct.com/forum/showthread....=&threadid=4748 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Polo Posted February 27, 2003 Report Share Posted February 27, 2003 Thanx for replaing.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sudden Posted May 1, 2003 Report Share Posted May 1, 2003 Instead of making a new topic I recycle this one. 1, Does it work to PC2MD a SP disc via OpenMG and then play it in a non MDLP unit? I'm thinking of getting a old MD to use were I don't want to risk my N707 but still be able to play disc's made by it. 2, Is there any way to PC2MD in SP without OpenMG crippleware? I know that Simple Burner only transfer in LP2/LP4 mode. Do Real's program support this? If so does it also have this check in/out limit? 3, Are a SP disc made by OpenMG still closed to edit/delete in a old non MDLP unit? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bazirker Posted May 1, 2003 Report Share Posted May 1, 2003 1. Yes, if it is in SP mode, an older minidisc unit can play it. 2. Crippleware...you have invented my new favorite term to describe sony software. There isn't a way to record sp mode without openmg faster than making a normal realtime recording. 3. Good question...I imagine the answer is the tracks are still protected. I'd go check it out for you, but I let my friend borrow my MZ-R70. If I remember correctly, I once made an sp disc so my R70 could read it, and then tracks were still protected...this is necessary if you want openmg to be able to check back in a track. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Anonymous Posted May 15, 2003 Report Share Posted May 15, 2003 Audio files cannot be uploaded to a NetMD recorder in real SP partly because the NetMD protocol doesn't support it. The software provided by sony only lets you encode in ATRAC3 instead of ATRAC. It is not obvious if the hardware can support it. In short, it just cannot be done for now. Any MD recorder (whether NetMD capable or not) can do real SP recording via optical as long as it has an optical input.if you dont use the net md programme to upload your music files you will get true SP Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marcnet Posted May 15, 2003 Report Share Posted May 15, 2003 Err... forgive me.. but that last post seems to be the most stupid sugestion ive heard unless, of course, there is some magic netmd software that dosnt suck like the sony stuff and does allow true sp transfers. IF such a thing does exist.. .where is it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.